Crank without a start
Okay, so a little back story. I have a 69 Bronco I built from ground up using google and youtube (first time working on a vehicle.) I have about 1400 miles on my build with a bone stock 302 from an 88 model Bronco. I'm also using an HEI setup, 23gal fuel tank, with an in tank electric fuel pump. Okay, so I originally ran a carb, but it kept dying at high operating temps ~190, and it wouldn't start back up. I'm from the south, and it is hotter than hell. I couldn't figure it out for the life of me, so I got frustrated and decided to go to fuel injection. I installed the FiTech, and it worked great until it got hot as well. The rep I told me that I couldn't use HEI, but that was false, as I had been running it. It ended up being a faulty plug going to the temp sensor and was throwing bogus info. So I spliced a new one on, and bam, it ran great. HOWEVER, it was doing the same thing as it was with the carb. I finally realized it was vapor locking when one day I felt the TB and it was unbearably hot and the return line was boiling. So I added an Edelbrock 9265 HEAT INSULATOR. This was a couple of days ago, and I didn't start it, as I was doing some painting on the underside.
Fast forward to today, I started it up to go take an inaugural "I'm finally done fixing it up" cruise and it died while I was putting my soft top up. After that, it would not start. The handheld gave me the usual fan relay code (I'm running fan clutch) that the handheld won't let me deactivate, and a new code for "IAC FAULT." I was in a hurry to get into the code to write some numbers down and I clicked twice and deleted it, so now the code won't come back, because I can't start it.
I am here now, because I am stumped. When I turn the key off after trying to crank, I can hear the IAC motor turning. I took it off and pushed the plunger into the open position to see if it was getting power, and it is closing to choke upon cranking. I took my multimeter to the pins, and from 1 to 2 was 52 ohms, 2 to 3 was 0 ohms, and 3 to 4 was 52 ohms. I also could not get the voltage to show up on the connector harness with the ignition on, but it has to be getting power if it is whirring after trying to crank.
I also tried putting a little gasoline into the top of the TB to see if maybe it was a fuel delivery issue, and it will start for a half second, but dies right after. I also hear the fuel pump kicking in whenever I try to crank. I'm going to go out and disconnect the line from the TB and see if fuel spits on when I turn the key on in a second. Anyone have any clue what I should check next?
Edit: I originally thought I might have fried something because of a ground. My intake has been grounded to my firewall since day one of engine installation, but I was wondering if that heat spacer might have ruined the ground the TB had on the intake and shorted something, so I added a ground from my TB to the firewall as well just to be sure. Both are using grounding straps and not chinsey little wires. Also, I took off the spacer to try, and had no luck, so I put it back on.
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First of all, very well done. You are far ahead of many so called builders. I would like you to train other members here how to post. Very well written and very detailed. Truck looks great. Would not believe that is your first build.
Yes, you can run an HEI. Especially when not running timing control. Fitech says an HEI cannot be used for t8m8ng control for liability purposes. It takes some customization. They must have been confused that day.
My only concern is the coil being that close to the ecu. We have issues with factory mounted external Ford coils on the manifold. But, hasn't seemed to be an issue.
Fuel vapor lock is an issue. I run a 1in wood spacer on mine. I live in Texas, HOT!!!! One thing to look at is fuel tank venting. The older vehicles didn't have a vent. Pressured tank can cause issues with EFI sometimes. Also, let's get a fuel pressure gauge on the unit. Fitech has a small mechanical one. I have it listed in the Parts and Accessories post. Drill and tap one of the fuel rail plugs on the front. Works great for a cheap gauge.
I think Fitech added Pro Tuning to the 400 software. Go to display and should be able to enable those menus. There you will find fan control settings.
Check your software version. Go to write to Ecu and read the default calibration names. Should be a 198i or 195o, or something like that. 198i is the most current version, but still they have added features to that software in updates. We may want to update your software. Check Membrs Section on how to obtain software. I have all of them.
Sometimes fresh software will clear up some of these gremlins. I would like to see an idle datalog when you get it running again.
Well, I pulled the fuel line hooked to TB and turned key ON. No fuel. I pulled the next fuel filter that's next to tank, and turned the key ON and no fuel. There were a bunch of broken plastic bits in the filter next to tank, though, so now I think pump sock is clogged.
OR, is it made to not pump fuel if something in the circuit is bad? I hear the fuel pump running for 4-6 seconds when key is turned ON.
Hey Austin,
I added an update prior to this post. I hadn't seen what you posted. I went and checked the software version and it is in fact a 198i. I have a newer unit. I'm going to drop the tank, and check the fuel sock. Everything on the Bronco is brand new. Every wire, hose, bushing, bolt, and part. I had a feeling the tank was going to have crud in it, but I was too lazy to disassemble before I installed it. If the tank ends up being clean, I'm definitely going to be back for more suggestions. I'm going to go order a fuel pressure gauge in a second, and read the write-up on how to install it. Also, there is a vent installed on this aftermarket tank, and I have a vent line running out of it with an inline fuel filter so that dirt dobbers or critters don't get in it and clog it up.
Also, thank you for the compliment. That Bronco is 3 years of work, lots of headaches and stress, and multiple broken parts (mostly due to me getting mad and stomping on shit or hitting shit with a ball peen hammer) including my first motor blowing up because I tightened the water pump too much and cracked the block and also had a bad leak because I bought a torque wrench that was in/lb instead of ft/lb and put my intake on at 15 in/lb with a humongous leak.
I'm back with an update. Here is what I did:
I disconnected the fuel line at the filter after gas tank, and ran the fuel pump. Pump kicked on, and no gas came out.
SO, I pulled my 23 gallon aftermarket M1A1 Sherman gas tank that I bought aftermarket "ready to install" from BCbroncos. Well, the mother F'er was about as ready to go as a Yugo. It was full of metal shards, strips of gasket materials, a plastic bracket that goes to who knows what AND the issue was the hose fell off of the pickup tube.
I siphoned all of the fuel out, cleaned out all of the crap, and stuck a magnet on the other side of the baffle wall. I then hooked the hose back up, and actually tightened it down.
However, the vehicle had the same issues with shutting down in super hot and humid (95 degree, 90% humidity) Alabama weather after hitting operating temperatures. I believe the culprit is still percolating at the throttlebody. It stays cool, when running, but it heats up to unbearable heat when sitting still in traffic and starts to stutter and die. As stated before, I added a heat spacer gasket, then
1. I pulled all of the fuel hose out, and wrapped it in foil duct tape.
2. Then I wrapped it all in plastic wire shield. I was hoping this would stop some of the heat from radiating to the hose and heating up the fuel a 2 more times in the return and intake.
3. Then, I had exhaust wrap laying around that I never got around to putting in, because the engine compartment is so small its a pain to pull out the exhaust manifolds without having to pull off accessories. I pulled and wrapped them. My poor hands have fiberglass stuck all in them.
4. Then, I added a larger open top (foam type) Edlebrock air breather.
5. Then, I added wrapped fire wall insulation that I had to the fuel hoses where they run down sandwiched (not touching, but easily absorbing radiated heat) between the firewall/body and motor/transmission.
6. I also removed the 30 micron inline fuel filter that was just post tank. I think it might have been slowing down the fuel pumping pressure, as its hitting a wall before it hits the 10 micron at the throttebody.
I'm going to take it to work tomorrow, and see how it runs. I noticed the IAC Steps are sitting at 3 when parked at operating temperature, which may be a little low. It was at 6 prior to me doing all of this and resetting the computer. I may do some final adjustments.
If all of this does not work, the only other thing I can think of doing is adding a functional hood scoop to try and increase air flow under the hood. Everything is painted black, and I think she is struggling in the air flow department despite my OVERSIZED 19" Derale steel fan and heavy duty fan clutch.
I'll be back with an update.
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How big is your fuel return line?
3/8" all the way through. I actually purchased the Fi-Tech complete kit that included all the fittings and hose plus and inline pump.
Ok, so you have an inline pump. Thought you had an in tank. No worries.
Under hood heat is an issue. I have had similar problems as I stated before. 1in wood spacer helped. You will get the most heat from the throttle body. Fuel lines don't pickup much.
I would like to see a fuel pressure gauge installed, so we can adjust the PWM and slow the pump. This will help with fuel heat. There is a guy on YouTube with a Fitech installed Bronco. Curious how his is doing with heat.
I'm running an in tank. I originally had an inline and it sounded like a swarm of bees. I'll take a picture of the fuel pressure though.
Update:
I my fuel pressure gauge finally came in, and my fuel tee comes in tomorrow afternoon. I'll hook it up and get definitive numbers. My air temperature dropped from 130 to 96-106 average after wrapping exhaust and fuel line. It started stuttering again today while test driving, but I was watching the dashboard as it happened. My LPM dropped from 40ish LPM at WOT to 0 LPM when the issue started. I'm hoping my fuel pump isn't going bad from the crud it sucked in, but I'll have definitive numbers soon.
Is my fuel pump supposed to run at 99-100% even at idle? It's done that since I installed.
If anyone is wondering about the Fi-Tec units, it's been great. The only issue I had with the unit was the faulty coolant sensor plug missing a prong. I'm hoping it's just too high of fuel pressure.